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Author	Topic: Beware Westin Owners!
Maz TUG Member Posts: 2757 From: Scottsdale,Arizona Registered: Dec 2000	posted 08-15-2004 10:57 Be advised, if you own at a Westin resort, you dont have the right to determine what you deposit with II. This is especially disturbing to owners at the really high demand Westins such as Maui and St. John. If you decide to deposit with II, you will most likely end up with a deposit from Palm Desert or some other lesser demanded Starwood property..... I deposited a week from our Westin St John and a deposit appeared in my II account from Westin Palm Desert. Needless to say I was not happy. I called Westin/Starwood and they said it was written in their agreement that they had the right to determine what we as owners get as II spacebanks. This is damaging to our trade power (Maui and St John owners). Has anyone else encountered this? Maz ------------------ Westin St. John Marriott Park City Sunterra-Scottsdale Oregon Coastal Fairfield Points Worldmark/Trendwest Punta Mita,Mx.(Non-Timeshare) IP: Logged
deniselew1 TUG Member Posts: 587 From: San Jose, CA USA Own at Westin Ka'anapali Registered: Aug 2003	posted 08-15-2004 13:49 I thought that we would get deposits from our home resort. I knew that they would choose the week for us, but not change the location. That sounds awful! Can anyone else confirm that they can deposit a different resort?! This doesn't seem to make sense, because how can they sell us a resort and brag about trading power if they can do that? IP: Logged
dbmMayer TUG Member Posts: 1955 From: Northern CA Owner: Westin Ka'anapali & Sheraton Desert Oasis Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-15-2004 14:27 That stinks! We have deposited our Westin Ka'anapali twice with SFX and we reserve the week that we want with Starwood and then deposit it - the week does not get changed. I don't even tell Starwood that I am going to exchange the week. I just reserve it for myself. ------------------ Denise IP: Logged
Maz TUG Member Posts: 2757 From: Scottsdale,Arizona Registered: Dec 2000	posted 08-15-2004 16:33 Its true....And get this...We own a fixed week at St John and we didnt even get that!! Maz ------------------ Westin St. John Marriott Park City Sunterra-Scottsdale Oregon Coastal Fairfield Points Worldmark/Trendwest Punta Mita,Mx.(Non-Timeshare) IP: Logged
Steve Barr TUG Member Posts: 434 From: Raleigh, NC USA Registered: Jan 2001	posted 08-15-2004 16:51 Maz, Very poor form on Westin's part. As I see it you have 3 choices: Sell if you want to stop doing business with Westin. Use the fixed week unit yourself each year or rent it out yourself (I'll go, just give me a call). Deposit your fixed week with an alternative exchange company. Not the best choices as I am sure that you had planned on sometimes trading and you have a great location. The more I see these problems with the trading companies (RCI, II, internal Marriott and Hilton, etc.) the happier I am that we either use or rent out each of our weeks. No muss, no fuss. ------------------ Steve H. Barr Raleigh, NC Assorted summer Daytona and North Carolina beach weeks. It's o.k. if you disagree with me, I fully respect your right to be wrong. IP: Logged
rfb813 TUG Member Posts: 208 From: Valrico, FL, USA Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-15-2004 17:19 Starwood (not Westin which is a just a brand) appears to have the same agreement with II that Hyatt has. When you request an exchange with the Starwood desk at II they take your request and provide a unit to II for exchange. Because of the demand for Hyatt and Starwood properties it seems that II gives them a priority. If the exchange trading power is not diminished why are you concerned. Starwood is probably managing it's properties so that the internal Staroptions availability is improved for it's members while providing a high trading value within II. This has worked well for Hyatt and I believe it will work well for Starwood owners whether Westin or Sheraton. ------------------ SBC II, Shell Island Beach Club, Marriott Mountainside, Marriott Grand Vista, Topsider I, Freeport Resort and Club, HGVC at Las Vegas Hilton, Vistana Resort IP: Logged
seenett TUG Member Posts: 931 From: Oregon , USA Owner: BeachPlace; Foxrun; Westin Kierland Registered: Jan 2001	posted 08-15-2004 17:50 That's just crazy. I understand them being able to pick the week tat they want to deposit, but to give you a week at a different resort? Especially when you own a FIXED week? Crazy. Let me check some more on this. On the bright side, since WMH doesn't have studios, they must have given you a one bedroom, right? ------------------ Chris [This message has been edited by seenett (edited 08-15-2004).] IP: Logged
deniselew1 TUG Member Posts: 587 From: San Jose, CA USA Own at Westin Ka'anapali Registered: Aug 2003	posted 08-15-2004 18:34 quote: Originally posted by rfb813: ...If the exchange trading power is not diminished why are you concerned. Starwood is probably managing it's properties so that the internal Staroptions availability is improved for it's members while providing a high trading value within II. This has worked well for Hyatt and I believe it will work well for Starwood owners whether Westin or Sheraton. If it is true that our trading power is not diminished, then it sounds good to me! IP: Logged
Maz TUG Member Posts: 2757 From: Scottsdale,Arizona Registered: Dec 2000	posted 08-15-2004 19:06 Chris, I own a 1br at St John so i would expect the same. I am fine with the fact that I got a 1br. The part I dont like is that I gave up my Westin St John and got an October week at Westin Mission Hills...Any week of the year at St John will have more trade power than an oct week in Palm Desert....Maz ------------------ Westin St. John Marriott Park City Sunterra-Scottsdale Oregon Coastal Fairfield Points Worldmark/Trendwest Punta Mita,Mx.(Non-Timeshare) IP: Logged
seenett TUG Member Posts: 931 From: Oregon , USA Owner: BeachPlace; Foxrun; Westin Kierland Registered: Jan 2001	posted 08-15-2004 19:57 quote: Originally posted by Maz: Chris, I own a 1br at St John so i would expect the same. I am fine with the fact that I got a 1br. The part I dont like is that I gave up my Westin St John and got an October week at Westin Mission Hills...Any week of the year at St John will have more trade power than an oct week in Palm Desert....Maz I totally agree with you. I thought you had a studio, though. No net-gain there. ------------------ Chris IP: Logged
sethnock TUG Member Posts: 620 From: New York, NY Own: HGVC Las Vegas,Orlando & Flamingo, Hyatt, Marriott Desert Springs, Marriott Summit Watch, Manhattan Club Registered: Jun 2002	posted 08-16-2004 09:22 Hi Maz, I am currently buying 2 weeks at Westin St Johns - week 11 and 12. I plan to only trade for other Westins (weeks 4-6 or 8-10 at Westin St Johns or Harborside). How can I expect the trading to be? Are the points the same? ------------------ Seth My Website [This message has been edited by sethnock (edited 08-16-2004).] IP: Logged
dbmMayer TUG Member Posts: 1955 From: Northern CA Owner: Westin Ka'anapali & Sheraton Desert Oasis Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-16-2004 13:11 quote: Originally posted by sethnock: Hi Maz, I am currently buying 2 weeks at Westin St Johns - week 11 and 12. I plan to only trade for other Westins (weeks 4-6 or 8-10 at Westin St Johns or Harborside). How can I expect the trading to be? Are the points the same? There is a StarOptions chart on the TUG advice page. (Points are something different.) Every Starwood resort has a different chart: http://www.tug2.net/advice/Starwood_Vacation_Network.htm You should have good luck exchanging within the Starwood system, if you call exactly 8 mos. before your desired date, to make your Resv. Maz is not talking about an internal exchange - HE went through II. (Edited to reverse Maz's sex change.) ------------------ Denise [This message has been edited by dbmMayer (edited 08-16-2004).] IP: Logged
Maz TUG Member Posts: 2757 From: Scottsdale,Arizona Registered: Dec 2000	posted 08-16-2004 18:22 "He" went through II ------------------ My Website Westin St. John Marriott Park City Sunterra-Scottsdale Oregon Coastal Fairfield Points Worldmark/Trendwest Punta Mita,Mx.(Non-Timeshare) IP: Logged
readyalready TUG Member Posts: 486 From: Englewood, CO Registered: May 2001	posted 08-16-2004 18:25 isn't there a request first option? IP: Logged
dbmMayer TUG Member Posts: 1955 From: Northern CA Owner: Westin Ka'anapali & Sheraton Desert Oasis Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-16-2004 18:44 quote: Originally posted by Maz: "He" went through II Ooppsss....sorry Maz! LOL ------------------ Denise IP: Logged
Marty Cloin TUG Member Posts: 56 From: mansfield,tx,usa Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-17-2004 18:26 Maz, you are a 100% correct about Starwood assigning any week they want from any resort and give it to II. Any one who knows how trading works will be upset with this type of control that Starwood has with owner weeks. It is good that you own from a mandatory resort so you can at least trade within the starwood system. I fell sorry for those starwood owners who have bought a voluntary starwood property and bought it resale(not being able to trade within the starwood program and not getting a good trade week to II). Fellow tuggers have a great day Marty IP: Logged
liubruin TUG Member Posts: 1603 From: Registered: Dec 2000	posted 08-17-2004 20:58 Marina, Does your week see other Starwood weeks in the II system ahead of non-Starwood owners? IP: Logged
BigGag TUG Member Posts: 89 From: Washington State Westin Mission Hills & Kierland Registered: Feb 2004	posted 08-18-2004 09:04 I get great trades through II with my Westin Mission Hills! Why would I only want to trade into another Starwood property when there are so many other great properties available throgh II. IP: Logged
JeffW TUG Member Posts: 1564 From: Philadelphia Registered: Dec 2000	posted 08-18-2004 14:27 quote: Originally posted by BigGag: ...Why would I only want to trade into another Starwood property when there are so many other great properties available throgh II. Many people buy into clubs or chain t/s's because the internal trading ability is often so much better. Hyatt's, for example, appear to be very rare on II exchanges, but doing internal exchanges for other Hyatts thru Hyatt Vacation Club often is very successful. There are probably similar stories for Disney, Marriott's, etc. Jeff IP: Logged
Marty Cloin TUG Member Posts: 56 From: mansfield,tx,usa Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-18-2004 17:30 Marina K,then the next time you trade your voluntary starwood property(remember what week you booked from starwood) see if interval has the same week that you deposited. I think you will see what I am talking about. You will see your trade value drop because starwood gives II any week at any resort they want to. I would recommend that you look at your starwood contract. I am trying to give you information that you may not know. Take care and have a great day fellow tugger. Marty [This message has been edited by Marty Cloin (edited 08-18-2004).] IP: Logged
aztoad Non Member Posts: 21 From: Phoenix, AZ, USA Registered: Aug 2001	posted 08-19-2004 08:12 Well, as a SDO owner, I guess this post has answered my question as to whether or not I should stay with RCI, or give II a try. I seem to get good trades through RCI right now, and would be hesitant to exchange through II, if I gave up a President's Week in AZ, and II deposited, say an August week for me instead!! IP: Logged
fredm TUG Member Posts: 171 From: Palm Desert, Ca. USA Registered: Jan 2003	posted 08-19-2004 16:29 I think that there are a couple of related issues here to be aware of. It's easy to discuss them as if they were the same but they are not. First, it is not a matter of Voluntary or Mandatory resort deposits that make the difference of how Starwood handles a deposit request. Owers at Voluntary resorts are SVN members also (except resale buyers). The issue that drives what happens is SVN membership itself. Marina_K is absolutely right-on with her comment about where control lies. If you are an SVN member, and own at a SVN Resort you are (no exceptions) bound by the Nework rules. These rules say, among other things, that EACH network member irrevocably assigns reservation rights at their home resort to the nework operator. The network operator is "expressly authorized to take such actions as they deem necessary or appropriate for operation of the network, including the implementation of all exchange program and reservation system duties...." That covers quite a lot of ground. So, in the interest of whatever they consider "appropriate for operation of the network", your booked weeks belong to SVN, period. To solidify their position consider this rule relating to "Banking for Anticipated External Exchnges"..... "When Home Resort inventory is not available in the bulk deposit accounts, deposits assigned to SVN members may be designated from other SVN Resorts..." That pretty well addresses the deposited week advisory Maz gave. Further,The Nework Operator is the only entity with a primary relationship with I.I. A member must contact the operator to requst an external exchange, Based upon that, and that alone, the operator places a deposit (entirely of their choosing) with the external exchange. Each member has a secondary or reference account with I.I. for identification purposes only. Why, because of the following: All the above relate specifically to the Network Rules, which must be agreed to. But, to become a member in the first place,the "SVN Owner Membership Agrreement" was signed. It says: "Owner acknowledges that membership in any external exchange program that, like SVN, requires its members to assign their right to the external exchange company operating such program, is incompatible with membership in SVN......If owner chooses to join such an external exchange program, SVN reserves the right to terminate this agreement." So, all SVN members must go to the Network operator. If deosits are made directly to any external company, SVN membership can be summarily terminated. To those who may not have been aware of that last diddy, it may be an excellent idea to keep a low profile of your activity and not share your experiences with others on a public board. Fredm [This message has been edited by fredm (edited 08-19-2004).] [This message has been edited by fredm (edited 08-19-2004).] IP: Logged
Marty Cloin TUG Member Posts: 56 From: mansfield,tx,usa Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-19-2004 19:16 Fred, does that mean if you buy a resale that is a voluntary starwood resort can you directly give your booked week to II(so you are in control of the booked week), or do you have to go through starwood to deposit your week to II? To my understanding you have to give your booked week to starwood and then they determine what week they give to II. I value your knowledge in this area and thank you for your time. Have a great day. Marty IP: Logged
dbmMayer TUG Member Posts: 1955 From: Northern CA Owner: Westin Ka'anapali & Sheraton Desert Oasis Registered: Jul 2003	posted 08-19-2004 21:38 quote: Originally posted by fredm: All the above relate specifically to the Network Rules, which must be agreed to. But, to become a member in the first place,the "SVN Owner Membership Agrreement" was signed. It says: "Owner acknowledges that membership in any external exchange program that, like SVN, requires its members to assign their right to the external exchange company operating such program, is incompatible with membership in SVN......If owner chooses to join such an external exchange program, SVN reserves the right to terminate this agreement." So, all SVN members must go to the Network operator. If deosits are made directly to any external company, SVN membership can be summarily terminated. To those who may not have been aware of that last diddy, it may be an excellent idea to keep a low profile of your activity and not share your experiences with others on a public board. I am sure that you are pulling this language out of an SVN document, but do you have any evidence that this has ever actually happened? I haven't used II, and I probably never will. When I make my deposit with SFX, they FAX a form to Starwood and Starwood signs off on it and releases the week to them, so obviously, they know that a week has been released to an exchange Co. other than II. ------------------ Denise [This message has been edited by dbmMayer (edited 08-20-2004).] IP: Logged
seenett TUG Member Posts: 931 From: Oregon , USA Owner: BeachPlace; Foxrun; Westin Kierland Registered: Jan 2001	posted 08-20-2004 09:43 quote: Originally posted by Marty Cloin: Fred, does that mean if you buy a resale that is a voluntary starwood resort can you directly give your booked week to II(so you are in control of the booked week), or do you have to go through starwood to deposit your week to II? To my understanding you have to give your booked week to starwood and then they determine what week they give to II. I value your knowledge in this area and thank you for your time. Have a great day. Marty Marty - It is my understanding that non-SVN members can deposit any week they can reserve. ------------------ Chris IP: Logged

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