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Liz Wolf-Spada TUG Member Posts: 2076 From: Wrightwood, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-18-2005 19:48 I had an MRI done a couple months ago after I had experienced 6 months of on and off pain in my back and radiating down my leg. My doctor glanced at the report and said it was the same osteoarthritis I knew I had. i showed it to a PT today and she said I have a pinched nerve and should see a neurosurgeon. I don't think my doctor read all the way to the bottom where it says this, "Right moderate to moderately severe forminal stenosis at L 4-5 could potentially result in a right L4 radiculopathy and explain the patient's stated symptoms. The findings are result of disc protrusion and asymmetric right facet hypertrophy." I missed a step in November, jolting my right foot, leg and back and this is the result. If any of you have similar problems please chime in. I had requested to get a second opinion from an orthopedic doctor, but I think my PT's suggestion of a neurosurgeon makes more sense, now that she explained it as a nerve problem. Thanks, Liz IP: Logged
Northernboy TUG Member Posts: 267 From: Resort: Sutherland Crossing FL Registered: Jul 2004	posted 05-18-2005 19:59 So what is a PT (a Part timer ?). Sounds like you need a disk shaved as its pressing on the nerve. Your problem has probably been developing for years, just that little event caused the disk to bulge out, and press on the nerve. Not a doc, just interested.......Peter ------------------ One of My Web Sites. IP: Logged
Liz Wolf-Spada TUG Member Posts: 2076 From: Wrightwood, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 01:05 Sorry, pt=physical therapist. Thanks for responding, Liz IP: Logged
JoAnn TUG Member Posts: 1872 From: Lehigh Acres FL Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 04:01 Liz, years ago DH had back pain, numbness in his leg and our orthopedic Dr. sent him to a neurosurgeon and we are glad he did. He came through surgery fine and hasn't had any problems since. Our daughter, who is a RN was glad Dad went this route too. Go talk to a neurosurgeon, and good luck. ------------------ JoAnn IP: Logged
nimrod TUG Member Posts: 32 From: Registered: Jul 2004	posted 05-19-2005 06:04 Liz, Have you tried conservative treatment first? Chiropractic adjustments, physical therapy, glucosamine sulfate, and acupuncture can be beneficial treatment options for you. If no success, next treatment option can be steroid injections. Surgery should be your last option. Best of luck. Mark IP: Logged
Whitecapper TUG Member Posts: 298 From: Garden Bay, BC, Canada Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 11:39 I had severe spinal stenosis last year, caused by a bulging disc in the L4-L5 vertebrae. The pain in my left leg was so severe that walking became next to impossible. The first doctor I saw suggested osteoarthritis, but I got a second opinion. The second doctor referred me to the spine clinic at the hospital. They gave me a choice of either the chemical solution (in effect, an epidural) which works 50% of the time, or the surgical solution (done microscopically) which works 95% of the time. I opted for the latter. The operation took longer than expected, and was more difficult than the surgeon originally anticipated, but the result was great. After a 3 to 4 month "take it easy" recuperation period, during which I was able to travel, everything is now back to normal. Have your physician refer you to a specialist. The specialist will explain your options and likely will be able to fix the problem. Good luck! IP: Logged
Liz Wolf-Spada TUG Member Posts: 2076 From: Wrightwood, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 12:53 Wow! You are terrific. Thanks. I have been doing chiropractic, physical therapy, acupunture and had already been using celebrex for fibromyalgia and osteoarthritis. I am definitely going to push for a surgical consult to find out what my options are. I don't want to undergo unnecessary surgery, but I don't want it to get worse either or to make my life more difficult, which it has been since November due to this recurrent problem. Thanks, Liz IP: Logged
zazu0526 Non Member Posts: 8 From: Royal Mayan Week 20 Registered: Sep 2004	posted 05-19-2005 16:40 The medical description denotes an aperture or perforation through a bone or a membranous structure around the L4 to L5 vertebra, which could potentially result in a disorder of the spinal nerve roots at L4, and is a result of hypertrophy of a small smooth area on a bone or other firm structure. This information came from Stedman's Medical Dictionary in looking up the symptoms. IP: Logged
Makai Guy Administrator TUG Volunteer Posts: 5470 From: Aiken, SC Prefer to be: Hawaii Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 17:25 Similar history. Lower back pain, with occasional pain and or numbness down one or both legs. Diagnosed as arthritis and put on a heavy physical therapy regimen that didn't help a whit. Continuted to get worse and worse. Kept pushing with new doctors. Xrays confirmed significant loss of thickness of the two bottom disks. Finally one did a nerve conductance test that confirmed nerve impairment. So finally we knew what to do and I just had to get bad enough to take the surgical risk. Got to where I could not be on my feet more than 5 minutes at a time. It was a timeshare trip to Sedona that pushed me over the edge -- when I was unable to hike some of those gorgeous trails I knew the time had come. Had surgery in '99 to remove the bottom two disks and fuse S-1 to L-4 and L-5, including some titanium rods and screws to hold the whole mess together. Worked very hard at rehabilitation for many months afterwards, and it paid off royally. As far as I am concerned, it gave me my life back. Since then I've talked to a number of people who have had essentially the same surgery, some with good results, some not. It is very interesting, though, that those who had good results ALL worked hard at rehabilitation following the surgery. ------------------ Doug Wilson, "The Makai Guy" Email me TUG Volunteer Coordinator & BBS Administrator My websites: North Shore Kauai and Yellowstone 2003 Photo Gallery IP: Logged
Liz Wolf-Spada TUG Member Posts: 2076 From: Wrightwood, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 17:52 I'm hoping that if I don't wait till it gets really bad, maybe I can have the "microscopic" surgery with minimal recovery time. Rehabilitation is hard when you have back problems and are a 45 minute drive to the physical therapist. Liz IP: Logged
mtngal TUG Member Posts: 359 From: Frazier Park, CA Registered: Jun 2003	posted 05-19-2005 19:12 I don't know what type of medical insurance set-up you have and how much you want to travel. However, UCLA's Medical Center has a Spine Clinic that deals with all spine problems. I was really impressed with them when I saw them last year and now that my back problems have worsened (it was expected, I just wasn't ready last year to do more than the most conservative treatment), I'm waiting for my health plan to approve the referral. IP: Logged
Liz Wolf-Spada TUG Member Posts: 2076 From: Wrightwood, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 19:26 Unfortunately, I just signed up for another year with Blue Shield HMO, was thinking of the PPO, but with three of us it was too expensive. Next year Sam can do part B Medicare and my son can do an individual Blue Shield plan. I had thought I could cope with another year of HMO. I will have to look into that clinic and see if they would refer me there. It is about 1 1/2 hours from our house, so far, but doable. Thanks, Liz IP: Logged
John Cummings TUG Member Posts: 2356 From: Murrieta, California Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-19-2005 23:50 quote: Originally posted by Liz Wolf-Spada: Unfortunately, I just signed up for another year with Blue Shield HMO, was thinking of the PPO, but with three of us it was too expensive. Next year Sam can do part B Medicare and my son can do an individual Blue Shield plan. I had thought I could cope with another year of HMO. I will have to look into that clinic and see if they would refer me there. It is about 1 1/2 hours from our house, so far, but doable. Thanks, Liz Why won't your HMO cover it or are you just referring to UCLA Spine Center? My mother had Health Net Seniors plus which is a Medicare HMO alternative. She had severe arthritis in her back and had complete treatment and surgery on her back at Scripps in San Diego. There was absolutely no cost to her whatsoever. I now have Secure Horizons which is another Medicare alternative insurance. ------------------ John IP: Logged
Present TUG Member Posts: 132 From: Florida, Charter Club of Marco Island Registered: Dec 2004	posted 05-20-2005 09:23 Liz, if your neurosurgeon decides that it is best to remove the disc (discectomy)...ask him if an artificial disc replacement is an option for you. The ADR helps to eliminate some latter-in-life complications from having the disc removed. And, hardship or not, like a previous poster said physical therapy is absolutely necessary to stablize the spine and learn a home exercise program / correct biomechanics to prevent further injury. Post-hospitalization the doctor can order home health physical therapy to get you started. ------------------ Helen IP: Logged
lanalee TUG Member Posts: 562 From: Pacific NW (state of Washington) Registered: May 2001	posted 05-20-2005 11:39 What a coincidence. My husband just had surgery on Monday. For months now, he's been experiencing numbness and weakness in both his legs. When he went to the doctor to check it out, he found out he had diabetes and the doctor assumed that was what was causing the problems in his legs. Turns out the diabetes diagnosis, while true, just clouded the real issue. After weeks of his legs getting weaker, he was referred to a neurosurgeon. He had an MRI done, x-rays and a nerve ending test, and the neurosurgeon found he had a pinched spinal chord in the neck area, which was causing problems in his legs as well shoulder and neck pains. He recommended a surgery called "arterial cervical fusion". He was in surgery about 2 hours where they took bone from his hip and then went in through the front of his neck to fix his spinal cord. So he has two incisions. Anyway, it's only been a few days, and he's already seen an improvement in his legs - they don't tighten up at night at all. Liz, good luck to you whatever you decide. IP: Logged
Ann-Marie TUG Member Posts: 937 From: Registered: Sep 2001	posted 05-20-2005 14:40 My back issues are very complex. However, when I opted for surgery, it was when I had 1 orthopedist surgeon consult, 2 neurosurgeon consults, and 2 neurologists who all told me I needed surgery, or I would be in a wheelchair. So, I did have the surgery. My pain from the disc problems is gone, but I suffer chronic pain that is more severe as a result of the surgery. My lower back developed scar tissue that has progressed down the L4-5 nerve, therefore occluding the entire nerve. My thoracic surgery had resulted in constant nerve pain and muscle spasms. As a result of the surgeries, I am now on disability for life. However, with all the opinions I had, I am 100% sure that I made the right decision. The point is, get as many consults as possible before making a decision for surgery. ------------------ Ann-Marie IP: Logged
3kids4me TUG Member Posts: 4357 From: Fairfield County, CT --Owner - Smugglers' Notch - 2 bedroom, week 33 plus float-- --- I remember PJ --- Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-20-2005 15:40 I had surgery when I was 24 years old because one of my discs had ruptured, making it really painful to stand and walk for long periods of time. I spent a year getting the proper diagnosis (MRIs were not too common back then, so for about six months all they did was x-rays...can't tell much from those!), and then another year finding the right doctor. I eventually had a fusion at the L5/S1 level. I am so glad I did this. Before the surgery, I couldn't even walk through a shopping mall without having to sit every few minutes. At the same time, sitting was also painful. I had pain going down one of my legs, which was the worst of all of it! Now I am pain free (some minor backaches every once in a while...but considering that I'm 40 I guess that's okay!). Most good doctors seem to read the MRIs themselves instead of relying on a radiology report. I'm convinced that I never could have had my three beautiful children if it weren't for that surgery. Some doctors tried to discourage me because I was young...but that's precisely the reason to have it...to get your quality of life back as soon as possible. I usually recommend spinal surgery because it's miserable to live with disc pain. However, you should make sure you don't have any other risk factors (i.e. smoking) and probably should also be of normal weight...because sometimes weight loss can take the pressure off discs. Also, as with any surgery, find the very best surgeon you can. (My surgeon went on to operate on Gloria Estefan, so I guess he was pretty good!) Good luck!! Sharon [This message has been edited by 3kids4me (edited 05-20-2005).] IP: Logged
Liz Wolf-Spada TUG Member Posts: 2076 From: Wrightwood, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-20-2005 16:34 I think I am going to copy and print all this great information and keep it in a file with the MRI report to refer to as needed. Thanks, Lots of back problems out there for sure. Liz IP: Logged
mtngal TUG Member Posts: 359 From: Frazier Park, CA Registered: Jun 2003	posted 05-20-2005 21:32 I was amazed by how much there is available now for back problems, even for common osteoarthritis. Healthnet "approved" my doctor's request, sort-of. Instead of sending me to the Spine Clinic as he put on his authorization request, they are sending me to the Orthopaedic Surgery Center! I'm not exactly a happy camper at the moment, but then that's nothing new for me when it comes to medical stuff in general. I'll go and see them, and they'll probably refer me on to the Spine Clinic (that's what happened last year), and Healthnet will eventually approve that and it will take me MONTHS to get treated! Meanwhile, I'm in pain, my doctor didn't offer me anything to replace Bextra (his attitude has always been "you have osteoarthritis, there's no treatment, live with it"), and it's harder and harder to work. The story actually goes on and on, and I'm SO FRUSTRATED! I'm beginning to think the whole medical system is designed to cause physical problems and promote suffering, rather than taking care of the patient. IP: Logged
Liz Wolf-Spada TUG Member Posts: 2076 From: Wrightwood, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-21-2005 18:23 I take Celebrex, 200 mg per day and glucosamine chondroitin as well. I know Celebrex is under review, but it seems to be mostly at higher doses. I hope it works out for you. I truly hate dealing with HMO's. I call it mismanaged health care and how it saves money when I have to go to one doctor to get a referral to another, I'll never know. It sure wastes more of my time. Liz IP: Logged
SteveH TUG Member Posts: 499 From: Ottawa, Canada Registered: Sep 2001	posted 05-22-2005 07:21 You may also want to try a magnesium supplement. I have suffered for years with lower back pain and although my pain may be more related to muscle spasms, I have found great relief by supplementing my diet with magnesium. When I feel a twinge or low-greade pain, I usually take 400 - 600 mgs several times a day and I find the pain subsides within a few hours. Obviously many of the back problems discussed in this thread are of a much more serious nature but used in combination with other therapies this supplement may also help. Steve IP: Logged
Whitecapper TUG Member Posts: 298 From: Garden Bay, BC, Canada Registered: Dec 2000	posted 05-22-2005 10:26 When I was experiencing pain as a result of spinal stenosis, the doctors I saw highly recommended either Ibuprophen (non-prescription) or Naproxin (which required a prescription). I believe Aleve is a Naproxin drug, and may be available without prescription. A friend of mine, who was experiencing similar problems was prescribed Vioxx, which helped her a lot. I understand it is now off the market because of the potentially harmful side-effects. IP: Logged

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