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Author Topic:   Won an E Bay auction have pay pal question
RodBrannan

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Posts: 190
From: Ankeny, Iowa
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-25-2005 07:58     Click Here to See the Profile for RodBrannan   Click Here to Email RodBrannan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I just won an auction on e bay for a 1 bedroom cliffs club for 900.00. I just got a pay pay invoice for a deposit of 500.00. The party I Purchased it from is called Vacations Unlimited LLC. They have no feedback. Also they are a new unverified personal member. Does anyone know if this is a safe way for me to pay. I have a few concerns that they have no feedback and they are not pay pal verified. What do you experts think?

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dbmMayer

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From: Northern CA Owner: Westin Ka'anapali & Sheraton Desert Oasis
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 05-25-2005 08:19     Click Here to See the Profile for dbmMayer   Click Here to Email dbmMayer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Paypal is perfectly safe, however, they won't do much to help you if the seller isn't. No offense, but why didn't you check them out before you bought?

------------------
Denise

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Dave M
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From: Boston, MA
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posted 05-25-2005 08:24     Click Here to See the Profile for Dave M   Click Here to Email Dave M     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
No way on this planet would I make such a payment under those circumstances. Insist on using an independent closing company known to you or to people here at TUG to escrow funds to ensure you get title. If the seller insists on doing it his/her way, back out of the deal.

I'm curious as to whether the PayPal requirement was stated in the auction terms when you bid.

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RodBrannan

TUG Member

Posts: 190
From: Ankeny, Iowa
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-25-2005 08:35     Click Here to See the Profile for RodBrannan   Click Here to Email RodBrannan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Denise, I had no way of knowing they were not going to be pay pal verified untill I got the pay pal invoice. I did call them on the phone and they are a timeshare resaler. I guess what I am asking is if I pay by credit card the 500.00 and they turn out not to be legit. Will my visa, mc, or discover card reimburse me? PS it was e bay item number 4381245137.
Thanks.
Rod

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Dave M
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From: Boston, MA
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posted 05-25-2005 08:42     Click Here to See the Profile for Dave M   Click Here to Email Dave M     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Please don't make a credit card payment with the expectation that you are protected. You should be, but you would be amazed at the situations where reimbursement was denied.

If this "reseller" is legitimate, they should not object to an independent closing service.

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RodBrannan

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Posts: 190
From: Ankeny, Iowa
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-25-2005 08:47     Click Here to See the Profile for RodBrannan   Click Here to Email RodBrannan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Dave, Can you reccomend one for me?
Thanks, Rod Brannan

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Dave M
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posted 05-25-2005 08:49     Click Here to See the Profile for Dave M   Click Here to Email Dave M     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I notice that the auction details how the payment was to be handled and indicates that the reseller is going to do the closing themselves.

I would not have bid on this item without getting agreement from the seller for the closing procedure I previously referred to. Too much risk when dealing with an unknown - particularly since they seem to have no significant Interent presence. (Try a Google search for "Vacations Unlimited, LLC". I did.)

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dbmMayer

TUG Member

Posts: 2346
From: Northern CA Owner: Westin Ka'anapali & Sheraton Desert Oasis
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 05-25-2005 08:51     Click Here to See the Profile for dbmMayer   Click Here to Email dbmMayer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Dave M:
Please don't make a credit card payment with the expectation that you are protected. You should be, but you would be amazed at the situations where reimbursement was denied.

If this "reseller" is legitimate, they should not object to an independent closing service.


It is my understanding, that for the buyer to pay with a credit card, the seller has to be Paypal certified. If they are not, you will have to make a fund transfer from your bank to Paypal instead. Or at least that was my experience with a recent purchase of $600. I tried to pay with a credit card, but the seller couldn't accept it, because he was not Paypal certified. I agree, insist on using a transfer Co.

------------------
Denise

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bogey21

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From: fort worth, texas usa
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posted 05-25-2005 08:51     Click Here to See the Profile for bogey21   Click Here to Email bogey21     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
When purchasing low price weeks on Ebay I have always just sent the money to the seller and not used an independent closing service. But then my seller has always had an excellent track record. Your deal though cries out for a closing service!!

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Dave M
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posted 05-25-2005 08:54     Click Here to See the Profile for Dave M   Click Here to Email Dave M     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
For some respected timeshare closing services, you can search this forum (using the "Search" link in the upper right section of this page) for words such as closing and company. Two threads that come up in such a search that have useful info include www.tug1.net/tugbbs1/Forum1/HTML/008575.html and www.tug1.net/tugbbs1/Forum1/HTML/008608.html

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SOS8260456

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Posts: 301
From: WILKES BARRE, PA, USA
Registered: May 2003

posted 05-25-2005 09:08     Click Here to See the Profile for SOS8260456   Click Here to Email SOS8260456     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I checked the auction out and I noticed the comment "deed notin own name". What does that mean? Also, the closing fees are pretty high for them doing it themselves. It could be perfectly legit, but this is one of those auctions that I personally would have stayed away from, they were pretty explicit in their terms and stating that don't bid if you didn't agree. They also don't give you much time to make a decision AFTER the auction. It was a 10 day auction so I guess they figured that was enough time to make a decision.

$900 plus those fees adds up to a significant chunk of change, although could be worse. Is it a timeshare that you really really really want and that is difficult to buy on the resale market for that price? Af not, then I would really really hesitate. Also, if you back out be prepared for bad feedback, but while it sounds bad to get bad feedback, you have the chance to explain yourself underneath it and while lots of people automatically block people with certain feedback percentages, if you email the seller and explain why you received the negative, most will allow you to bid.

Good luck in your decision.

Lisa

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RodBrannan

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Posts: 190
From: Ankeny, Iowa
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-25-2005 09:31     Click Here to See the Profile for RodBrannan   Click Here to Email RodBrannan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Thanks for all the advice. I think they are legit but I just sent them an e mail asking to use an independent closing company. I will let you know what their response is.
Thanks, Rod Brannan

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RodBrannan

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Posts: 190
From: Ankeny, Iowa
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-25-2005 09:40     Click Here to See the Profile for RodBrannan   Click Here to Email RodBrannan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Dave, I had done a google search before and came up with nothing. Did you find anything?
Thanks, Rod

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RodBrannan

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Posts: 190
From: Ankeny, Iowa
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-25-2005 09:48     Click Here to See the Profile for RodBrannan   Click Here to Email RodBrannan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I just found that I can also make the cahck payable to Tom Holbird PC. I did a search on him and found a web site for his law practice. I am going to give him a call.

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SOS8260456

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Posts: 301
From: WILKES BARRE, PA, USA
Registered: May 2003

posted 05-25-2005 11:40     Click Here to See the Profile for SOS8260456   Click Here to Email SOS8260456     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
That is much more reassuring.

Lisa

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zdxlc9p6

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Posts: 18
From: Two HGVC in Florida & Krystal in Cancun
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 05-25-2005 12:19     Click Here to See the Profile for zdxlc9p6     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I too won an aution from this company. The auction description indicated "escrow", but then found after the auction they are not an escrow company. PayPal does not offer buyer protection because they are not PP verified. I sent them a request to use an escrow company of my choice, and they replied "After we receive these papers from you we may proceed to use the closing company of your choice. We still retain the option to not use an
independent closing company and to use our own." I am going to forward them a company name, and will only complete the deal if they agree.

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zdxlc9p6

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Posts: 18
From: Two HGVC in Florida & Krystal in Cancun
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 05-28-2005 04:38     Click Here to See the Profile for zdxlc9p6     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I proposed Chicago & Title! They responded that they understood my concerns, and proposed that I could submit the money to their lawyer's escrow account. Got a good price of half of what I paid for another unit after market at the same resort 2 years ago. Escrow account is tempting. Anyone know the risks with a lawyer escrow in Georgia?

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Steve83014
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From: Salt Lake City, Utah Own: Marriott's Sunset Pointe, Hilton Head Island, SC
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-28-2005 07:48     Click Here to See the Profile for Steve83014   Click Here to Email Steve83014     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I realize that I'm going against the grain of this thread a bit, but I really feel that you needed to work this out with the seller BEFORE you bid on the auction. Ebay makes it very clear that you have entered into a legally binding contract and that you are obligated to complete your side of the transaction. If you want to use an independent closing company, you should be allowed to, but you needed to discuss that with the seller before bidding.

It's really not fair to the seller to bid on an item if you are not prepared to purchase the item on the terms spelled out in the listing...unless you and the seller come to a mutual agreement beforehand.

Steve

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zdxlc9p6

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Posts: 18
From: Two HGVC in Florida & Krystal in Cancun
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 05-28-2005 14:58     Click Here to See the Profile for zdxlc9p6     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I generally agree. However, if you look at my 5/25 post, their description was a bit misleading. It stated "....of transfer and escrow services. All closing costs and procedures will be handled through Vacations Unlimited, LLC." With escrow services indicated, I placed my bid. After the auction, the first email from them included "We are not an escrow company nor are we a broker. Closing costs go towards the attorney who handles the transfer paperwork. All closing procedures must be completed through Vacations Unlimited, LLC." In my opinion, they changed some key information (removed escrow) which caused my concerns. They subsequently indicated they would be willing to allow an independant escrow company, and then came back and advised me that I could use their attorney's escrow instead. That is why I asked if an attorney's escrow would be save. Thanks for the input.

[This message has been edited by zdxlc9p6 (edited 05-28-2005).]

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RodBrannan

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Posts: 190
From: Ankeny, Iowa
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-29-2005 09:19     Click Here to See the Profile for RodBrannan   Click Here to Email RodBrannan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Steve, I agree with you. But I was a little stunned when they were not pay pal verified. Just how do I check that? If you know a way please tell me.
Thnaks, Rod

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camachinist

TUG Member

Posts: 1628
From: Kerman, CA
Registered: Feb 2004

posted 05-29-2005 10:22     Click Here to See the Profile for camachinist     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
quote:
Originally posted by RodBrannan:
Steve, I agree with you. But I was a little stunned when they were not pay pal verified. Just how do I check that? If you know a way please tell me.
Thnaks, Rod

Just do a dummy "send money" transaction using the person's e-mail. Before confirming the transfer (which you won't do of course), you'll see a page showing the e-mail address, whether it's verified, and how many unique positive transactions have taken place involving it. you can click on the link next to the person's e-mail for more specific information.

There may be easier ways, but that's always worked for me.

Hope that helps!

Pat

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Heron

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Posts: 1581
From: Ont, Canada
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 05-29-2005 12:07     Click Here to See the Profile for Heron   Click Here to Email Heron     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
Copy/pasted from Paypal's site:
quote:

Member Status Information is provided to assist buyers in determining how active a seller has been in the PayPal community. As an added security measure, the buyer must have a PayPal account in order to view the member status information.

Member Information provided on sellers:

* Seller Reputation Number
* Account Status
* Account Type
* Account Creation Date
* Time In System
* Payment Receiving Preferences are displayed for a Business and Premier Members
* Business URL, Customer Service Email Address and Customer Service Phone Number are displayed for Business Members

How to View Seller Information

When a buyer makes a payment, a link to the Member Information Box is provided on the Send Money Confirmation page. To view Member Information:

# Click the Send Money tab to locate Member Information.
# Complete the form to send a payment and click Continue.
# Click the blue link to the right of User Status. A Member Information page pops up with the seller's information.
# Click Send Money to complete your payment, or click Cancel to stop the payment.


You can do the above without having made the purchase by copy/pasting their email address into Paypal's "send money" tab.

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zdxlc9p6

TUG Member

Posts: 18
From: Two HGVC in Florida & Krystal in Cancun
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 05-31-2005 11:02     Click Here to See the Profile for zdxlc9p6     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
It looks like PayPal does not offer protection on timeshare auctions. I am a verified seller, and PP protection shows on my listings immediately below the seller information block. I also have a TS listed, and PP protection is not stated for that auction. Perhaps they had to cover too many scam sellers?

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markb

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From:
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 06-05-2005 01:21     Click Here to See the Profile for markb   Click Here to Email markb     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I also won an eBay auction from this firm. I likewise became uncomfortable when I received the unverified Paypal money request and learned it was not a true escrow. With 0 feedback, it smelled very fishy though my gut feeling is that it is legit.

I asked them to use my closing company but after calling and speaking with my person, they refused. They said to send the money to their attorney but I said that is not a trust account independent of their firm. I finally said, look, I have 175 positive eBay feedback score and you have 0. Close the purchase without any payment from me, and when I get the recorded deed I will pay you. I think that is fair, under the circumstances, and would have gotten them the positive feedback they sorely need. But understandably, they said no (they want money upfront, as we all do), and we mutually agreed to cancel the purchase.

Once they get some positive feedback I might try again. I would also note for those critics out there, the auction states it is only an interest to purchase and sell, so the company is under the belief it is not a binding auction (I'm not sure they are correct, but this is an "out" for both parties to negotiate after the auction ends).

I would also point out that in real estate, it is customary for the buyer to choose the escrow and title company. Regardless of what is stated in an auction, you should be able to steer the sale to your choice of escrow agents. This is not always possible, due to the way the deeds and notifications are handled by some resellers (e.g., those who get powers of attorney but don't own what they are selling...). But I don't feel it is absolutely necessary to get a seller's OK prior to bidding if you MAY (not WILL) decide to go with your own agent. I don't usually insist except when it looks like I am unprotected, such as it appears on this seller.

So, be careful out there and let us all know if you have a good experience with this seller. Thanks!

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rklein001

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From:
Registered: Jul 2001

posted 06-05-2005 11:15     Click Here to See the Profile for rklein001   Click Here to Email rklein001     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote Post A Reply
I wouldn't hesitate to pay money into an attorney's escrow account, as long as I had a letter from the attorney describing in what circumstances the attorney would release the escrow to the seller (in your case, on delivery of a deed to you in form fit for recording or, if the attorney is going to certify title, on delivery of a deed to you bearing good title), and to the buyer (in your case, on a failure for you to receive such a deed from seller by a given outside date after making full payment to the escrow account).

Attorneys who take funds out of their escrow account without proper authority get disbarred.

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