posted 04-25-2005 00:30               

I just returned from a trip to Westin Maui. My girlfriend and I were there on the standard 5-nights hotel/car vacation offer for $750.

Lured by the 7500 starpoints offer, we attended the SVO presentation and ended up buying into a 2BR OV EY AND a 2BR OV EOY (for elite status). What really attracted me was the ability to convert unused time to Starpoints. From all the posts on this forum, it seems like there is a general consesus that converting to Startpoints will not get the best value. However, for my personal situation, Starpoints is very valuable to me.

I love the Westin brand and the Maui location but I don't envision myself going back to Hawaii year after year. Since my lifestyle takes me to different parts of the world, I like the flexibility of the Starpoints and the value I can get out of it if used properly for high-value redemptions. I also like the ability to trade for other locations in the SVN network like the upcoming Cancun villas.

With 2 units, I will qualify for SVN Elite status that allows me to transfer to Starpoints annually. On the even years, I will be able to convert to 80,000 Starpoints and 160,000 Starpoints on the odd years.

The pricing/incentive is as follows:

2BR OV EY:
Price: $48,900
Incentives: 40,000 Starpoints + Gold Status for life of ownership

2BR OV EOY:
Price: $24,500 (current promotion of 50% off for addition EOY purchases)
Incentives: 30,000 Starpoints

I have 3 more days before I lose my ability to rescind the purchase.

Please, all your timeshare gurus out there, let me know what you think of my purchase and if I am making the best decision?

Will I get better value by buying at another (cheaper) SVO location such as Kierland?

posted 04-25-2005 04:29               

If you have been reviewing past postings, you would realize that there are difference in philosophies out there. Some would swear never to buy from developer, while others are enamored by the incentives the developer.

In your case, I am in agreement with you that the annual Starpoints conversion is a good thing, allowing for great deal of flexibility with last minute travel. I have used my Starpoints on several occasions to stay at hotel, saving me some money in the process. Just yesterday, I decided to go to Washington, DC on a cheap flight in order to take advantage of the double Rapid Rewards points offer. So, I booked a room at the Westin Embassy Row using 10,000 Starpoints. This room would otherwise cost me over $300.

It sounds like you do a lot of travelling, and you like the upper level of services and amenities available at Westin. So, the ability to stay at Westin, W, St. Regis, and others is very attractive to you.

However, from a value standpoint, I definitely think you can do better. If you plan to go to Hawaii for future vacations, then many tuggers will tell you to buy at where you want to go. However, if you are not bent on going to Hawaii, you can probably buy from developer at Kierland, and get the elite status for less initial cost and less annual maintanence fees. I bought a week at Westin Kierland (2 BR Lockoff) from the developer, with a Starpoint value of 72,000, with initial investment of $27K and annual MF of roughly $800. (I'm sure the prices are higher now). I have recently decided to buy a resale week at Vistana Villages to get me to elite status so I can convert my Kierland week to Starpoints, if I choose.

You can also do more homework and find a resale at a mandatory SVN resort for cheaper. A mandatory resort is the only way to go to be able to do an internal exchange for other SVN resorts. However, you won't be able to convert it to Starpoints. You would have to buy both weeks from developer if you want to convert both to Starpoints. The way I did it, I can convert my Kierland week annually to Starpoints, and use my Vistana Villages week to go to other SVN resorts annually.

posted 04-25-2005 06:16            

While you will get much debate on TUG as to whether its better to buy resale vs the developer, it is really an individual decision and possbily a function of how much and where you like to travel. Personally, I do not regret having bought from the developer. I travelled to Italy last year and used Starpoints to stay in very expensive high-end hotels where the room rates (including tax) were $550 per night. While I recognize that the best value is clearly using your timeshare rather than converting it to Starpoints - I do like having the option to convert every year if I want to do so - and I am considering doing so next year. I like knowing that I have a cache of Starpoints that I can using anytime whenever I want to travel.

If you don't intend to travel to Maui every year you might consider, as you noted, buying at Kierland - maybe an EY 2 BR and an EOY or, possibly, an EY 2 BR platinum and an EY 2 BR gold - as it will save you purchase price and maintenance - over buying in Maui BUT you will have to hope you're lucky enough to be able to trade into Maui. You might also consider an EY 2 BR at Kierland and an EOY 2 BR in Maui - as that would assure you of being able to go to Maui.

posted 04-25-2005 08:37            

But if you travel a lot, you could use a Starwood AMX and make a ton of points without buying two units at one of Starwoods most expensive resorts. Especially if you don't want to use Maui on a consistant basis. If you are not familiar with flyertalk.com you may want to also check their Hotel boards for the Starwood board. There is plenty of debate about what a Starpoint is worth, and the "devaluation" of what a Starpoint will let you exchange into. Right now, a room at the Westin or W can be had for 10K points, but the future is an open book, and it could be potentially disappointing to assume that the Starpoints you lock in now with an Elite purchase will give you the same level of hotels or number of hotel days in the future.

I have been to Maui, Kierland, and St. John. They are all great resorts, wonderful places to spend a week or two..... but maybe it's not a 100% perfect fit for you and your style of traveling. I know that as a former global executive/expat if I had remained childless, it would not have necessarily been a great fit for me. No Costa Rica, no Thailand, no funky boutique resort location in Vieques..... Starwood does not always have the hot new hotel of the moment. It's a big investment to lock-in a specific style of traveling, that may or may not always be appealing.

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Shelley

posted 04-25-2005 09:07               

How was the weather in Maui?! You bought exactly what I wish I owned. We could go to Maui for 2 weeks every other year, just perfect for my family with small children. We currently own one EY, but I keep looking for the money for that EOY.

We bought from the developer and have no regrets. We love Maui and plan to go there every year, at least for the next ten years or so while our kids are young.

You need to think about where you want to travel, and if it is within SVN, how far in advance you would be able to plan. We bought at Maui because we wanted the 12-month reservation window. If you are flexible with your plans and can risk booking 8 months out, then you would save money by buying somewhere else like Kierland. Or you could buy one of your intervals at Maui and the other at Kierland.

Think about maintenance fees too, and how much it will cost you each year for these intervals.

If I had the money, I'd buy what you bought and be really happy!

If you have any serious doubts or money issues, I'd consider rescinding. If you want Starpoint conversion every year, then a developer Elite purchase is the only way to go.

Good luck!

[This message has been edited by deniselew1 (edited 04-25-2005).]

posted 04-25-2005 10:37               

Weather in Maui was absolutely fabulous. Couldn't have been better. A bit Windy at times but I really enjoyed the breeze, if you can call it that.

I think the amount of incentive Starpoints at Maui has decreased dramatically due to the fact that they are projecting 30 days from being sold-out.

As winkng pointed out, I do quite a bit of travelling and really enjoy the upper level of service and amenities at Westin. The primary reasons for me to buy into SVO is for the lifetime Gold status, Starpoints, and flexibilty to get into SVN resorts.

When I do vacation, my dates are usually very flexible and I don't usually go back to the same destinations so having priority at Maui is not a must-have for me.

Buying completely from resale is out of the question because I feel I can get a lot of value from the way I would use the ability to convert to Starpoints. That said, I will look into the possibility of buying a 2BR EY from the developer and a supplemental unit from resale to bump me up to Elite status.

It seems like there is a consensus that Kierland would offer the best value in terms of the cost for the equivelant units I have been looking at, incentive, maintenance fees, and Starpoint conversion rate. My only concern with Kierland is that I don't think I will actually visit Kierland a whole lot, if at all since I do prefer beach destinations.

In terms of selling in the future, I think I would fare better with Maui than Kierland. What about the ability to rent out my unit at Kierland? Is it going to be a challenge?
[This message has been edited by beelz0308 (edited 04-25-2005).]

posted 04-25-2005 10:39               

My first reaction, based on the questions asked, was to second what Yellow Audi suggested. Buy the EOY at Maui and the EY at Kierland, as long as they are destinations that you are interested in. If solely for the StarOptions, find the cheapest resale ones you can, but my guess is that you really want the points conversion ability, so resale is out. I got a lot of points when I purchased Kierland, but I get many, many more from using the Starwood AMEX. Right now I have 16 rewards nights scheduled, including Princeville in Hawaii, New Orleans, and Mont Tremblant in Canada. It's my main card.

Another strategy I've read here talked about buying a mandatory resale and THEN buying the developer property. From the reports on this board, privileges would be granted retrospectively to the resale that would not normally apply. Perhaps one of the gurus can amplify on this for the original poster.

posted 04-25-2005 11:17               

When it come to exchanging within the SVN system, it doesn't matter what resort you are exchanging - the only thing that matters is how many StarOptions the unit is worth. So XXX StarOptions from Kierland have the same value as XXX StarOptions from WKORV in an exchange.

As far as selling in the near future - if you are even considering selling in the near future, you shouldn't be buying a timeshare!

However, I am one of the people who don't think that converting to StarPoints is a good value. Look at what the unit costs you upfront + interest + maintenance fees. For what you are paying, you could just stay in a hotel for the same price or less.

posted 04-26-2005 10:59               

I am not a financial guru so I just threw this sheet together based on what I know. Please take a look and let me know what I'm missing.
http://home.comcast.net/~paulchang8178/Book3.xls

Thanks!

posted 04-26-2005 11:14               

quote:

---

Originally posted by readyalready:
I didn't look in much detail but off the top of my head think that your 4k in rent every year is far from a slam dunk.

---

Definitely - I tried to rent my 1 bdm. at Ka'anapali for 6 mos last year for $200 a night and couldn't do it. (And it was Easter week!) Since people can rent directly from Starwood with much more flexibility, you have to seriously undercut their rental rate to be successful. I would cut that rental figure in half at least.

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Denise

posted 04-26-2005 15:06               

Since you seem to be primarily interested in converting to StarPoints for hotel stays, what if you put the same amount into an interest bearing acct. every month? It would pay for a lot of hotel rooms...

posted 04-27-2005 19:34               

Which ever way you go, if you buy at the WKORV, you are gonna love it...

Aloha!